Updating post from Reddit.
I am a tenant and served my tenant break notice to move out in September.
The agent said they will list the property in mid July and arrange viewings.
I don't see any particular clause stating I need to entertain viewings. I don't want to agree to any viewings as I hate random people coming in and out.
Can I just refuse to any viewings? If I say no to a time, the agent will surely ask when I can do, can I just say I will not accept any at all until my last day.
You have a right to refuse viewings.
LL has a right to give you a bad reference.
Says everything about Landlords that 'tenant enforced their legal rights' results in a bad reference
Bad, as in "they refused to allow viewings"? That's not a bad reference, it's just a petty retort.
Bad as in "I do not recommend this tenant".
In this economy with many people looking over the amount of flats available, I would turn you down on this reference.
In this economy or any other I wouldn't let from a cunt like you.
Have a day.
Please Keep it Civil
You say that, when the landlords sell up due to this awful new legislation coming in. You may have no choice but to rent from 'cunts' and if you don't have a glowing reference, good luck or you'll be down the council begging with the rest of the crowd.
Get off your high horse. Tenants acting all high and mighty is so pathetic to see.
The housing crisis has been caused by the government not landlords.
I understand peoples frustration though.
100% agree, yet every where you look tenants seem to go at landlords like they are all scum.
The majority of landlords are exactly that, and going by the petty attitude here it's not far off from the truth. I'm a home owner, never rented, and honestly I can see why tenants wouldn't like landlords here.
Actual comment in this thread
"Why would you want to be awkward to a landlord that has been fair and reasonable towards you. Just because you think you can? If I were your landlord I would claim against your deposit, bad reference you, and anything else in my power to give you a dose of Karma. Self righteous entitlement has a habit of biting back. "
Oh well go fuck yourself then 🤷♂️
Please Keep it Civil
Anyone else being petty here?
Yes you can refuse.
If your LL has been pretty good then I would reconsider otherwise expect them to nitpick on everything when you leave.
Agents have to give 24hrs notice for viewings - likelihood is if it’s an a high demand area it delta straightaway and you end your tenancy on good terms.
Imagine if you were a tenant wanting to move in somewhere in September and you couldn’t because you couldn’t do viewings….imagine you viewed the current property when it was with tenant in situ?
Imagine a poor landlord has to go a whole month without any money
Any void periods get factored into the rental amount. It's the tenants who end up paying for it.
Is that always the case, I'd have thought the owner rents at the maximum possible market rate and this isn't directly correlated to the void period but rather what the market will pay for the flat?
Landlords nearly always go for maximum market value, they don't run a charity and will charge the max they can get away with.
I don't think it's uncommon to rent properties below market value, I know I certainly have some.
I need to ensure the properties are still profitable so, even renting below market value, I will still take into account void periods when setting my rental amount.
I think when it comes to renting below market value it would usually be to an existing, long term and good tenant. Not sure many people start an existing tenancy below virtually the max they could get.
I think the counter point is true, the longer the void periods all the landlords I know actually reduce the price just to get somebody through the door. Everybodys unique approach will vary but I think there is little to suggest landlords price below due to good void periods, infact it shows they can raise the prices and not suffer a loss of income and macro data backs it up as a general rule of thumb.
Why is your flair set as landlord out of interest?
Back to your original question, as others have said it might be worth trying to have some come and go with the agents but ultimately no you don’t need to allow viewings. I’m a firm believer in the phrase ‘ the toes you step on today might be connected to the ass you kiss tomorrow’ so if I can accommodate people I do.
I think you are referring to common decency. It’s not so common anymore. But I do hope karma pays a visit to people who are in the “not my problem” brigade. They’ll be the first ones crying for help when they need it.
Because I am also a LL. And no, I don't believe that phrase in this world, not anymore.
So we’ll put you in the horrible human being camp then…
Did you know there's a search function on subreddits? I'm convinced people don't realise you can search them.
Yes, but then he wouldn’t get to show off his username and get negative attention for his antisocial comments.
search is so terrible on Reddit. I literally would rather search on Google and then type Reddit next to it and I'm more likely to get what I need
Viewings cannot be conducted without your permission and you are free to refuse even on your last day.
This. Also, change your locks, replacing the old ones when you leave.
Edit: a lot of salty, bitter and entitled landlords in this thread...
Would you not expect to view your next rental property prior to moving in ?
Yeah, after the previous tenants have left.
Would you not expect the right to quiet enjoyment of the flat you were paying alot to rent?
Why would you want to be awkward to a landlord that has been fair and reasonable towards you. Just because you think you can? If I were your landlord I would claim against your deposit, bad reference you, and anything else in my power to give you a dose of Karma. Self righteous entitlement has a habit of biting back.
“Self righteous sentiment” errr legal entitlement
Precisely- “Entitled” very apt!
Acting entitled and being entitled are different things
but what the tenant is doing is legal your reaction to it is illegal. If I'm paying god knows how much to rent this house I'm doing it expecting no interruptions. Can you imagine if you rent a car but then the company randomly calls you and asks you not to use it for a couple of hours so someone can come and see it? You'd ask for compensation
Lack of basic knowledge about rules.
You can’t claim against deposit for refusal to allow viewings. No DPS will offer a penny.
Probably easier just giving a bad reference to balance things out if everyone wants to be petty.
You’re right - lack of basic knowledge. If the landlord can evidence they have suffered a loss they can make a claim against the deposit for breaches of the tenancy contract. To quote the TDS website- “the adjudicator must be persuaded on the balance of probabilities that the tenant had breached their obligations, and that the landlord has suffered or is likely to suffer a loss a result”. A claim of this nature is entirely legitimate and landlords are not barred as you claim.
it's not an obligation to allow strangers into your home. it's not even an obligation to allow your landlord into your home
In this economy and the high demand it’s very unlikely to be disruptive, there’s a high chance it will be gone very quickly.. unless the property is badly maintained or the rent is very expensive or bad value.
I already signed rental agreement. I pay top dollar
>I pay top dollar
Yeah. You and every other tenant...
What I can't get my head around is why you own property to let, and yet you rent where you live... Just seems counter-intuitive to me.
Edit:
>Have a high company rental allowance
Guess it makes more sense if you're not paying your own rent..
Can we trade problems...? I'd much rather deal with your 'issues'..
Landlord perspective - I would not be amused if you did this.
It would be a factor in your reference.
But, only one factor. I suspect if you are disinclined to allow viewings you are also the kind of tenant to be a pain over several other minor things too.
However, after a tenant leaves, I expect some downtime. That is for me to inspect the premises, clean it up, fix whatever needs fixing etc. Also an opportunity to upgrade and replace stuff. And, I *personally* don't conduct viewings until I think the place is ready.
So:
1 - being uncooperative nets you bad karma
2 - as a LL I would want to fix things up before conducting viewings anyway
Why would you want to refuse? Going by this entire post I don’t expect an answer lol
Bit scummy if you're the one that served notice.
Why don’t you work with the landlord and come to some sort of agreement rather than getting on the wrong side especially if you are a serial renter.
What possible incentive is there for the tenant?
Living in a world where people consider others?
So if the tenant says no and the landlord gets upset and gives a future bad reference based on that alone, we're being considerate here?
Let's look at the bigger picture.
If all tenants did this then there would be a predictable empty month after any tenancy.
Landlords would account for this by raising the rent to offset the empty period.
This would cause all tenants to pay higher rents for the sole benefit of avoiding a day or two of viewings in the last month of their tenancy. In a situation where the tenant has chosen to end the tenancy, it doesn't seem like this is the biggest inconvenience in the world.
So yeah, I'd say it's inconsiderate, not just to the landlord and agency directly, but indirectly to all other renters.
I think most landlords put the rent up so it matches the market. You can explain to me why the market is where it's at and you're likely right, but I think most people don't think that far and just match what the market says.
The house is a home for the tenant. The tenant is income for the landlord. Quite the uneven ground here.
I had good landlords before and because they treated me like a human, I had visitors over and explained to them it's a great place to live and I'm only moving because I found a job elsewhere.
Now when it comes to the bad ones..fill in the blanks..
I am coming from a place of curiosity and understanding, but why should I care how much money the landlord makes if I respect the contract and keep the house clean? What favours has the landlord done for me so I can in exchange do the same?
I do think it's an inconvenience for strangers that you can't verify who comes into my house and steal my belongings for then the tenant to chase up with the police who couldn't care less about this, yea it's a little inconvenient for the tenant I'd say..to give one example. Now compare this inconvenience to the landlord missing a month rent pay.
So you've completely glossed over the point about "if everyone did it" on the rent costs. If every tenancy starts to include an empty month because you can't even show the place until it's vacated, that's going to get put out in increased rents because it will affect every landlord. This isn't one deciding to go against the market, it's the whole market adapting to a change.
As to the viewings, I'm of the opinion that these should be done over at most two seperate days, agreed well in advance with the tenant so that they can be present if they want to be. This helps cover you for keeping an eye on anyone trying to pinch things, but also gives plenty of time to put valuables away.
Fair or not, it is the system we have, and any changes will cause consequences, usually in the form of higher rents.
I haven't glossed over that, I've got nothing to add or disagree with on that.
Good reference. Speedy return of the deposit.
Guaranteed there is a clause in the agreement that reads: The tenant must allow on 24 hours written notice the landlord or his/her workmen for the purpose of repairs and in the last two months of the tenancy viewings.
Pretty sure the law says something different.
No, the law is pretty clear on this… https://www.gov.uk/private-renting#:~:text=Your%20responsibilities,or%20your%20landlord%20allows%20it
To be fair, 'to inspect it and carry out repairs.' doesn't include carrying out viewings.
That's for maintenance, not viewings. If you refuse the viewings the landlord can then evict you for breach of tenancy but if you are moving out what would be the point? They will then try and claim against your deposit for a void period but this will fall flat because it's outside of th tenancy and deposit only covers losses during the tenancy period. Agency in Bristol tried this recently with a friend, refused all viewings, ll tried to claim void on the deposit, all monies returned by the deposit scheme.
That's logical, all other negative comments are by entitled landlors who are making no sense
Did you pass Year2 primary school comprehension?
Law laughs at your scribbles on tenancy agreement, the only thing that matters on tenancy agreement is the rent amount, address and names of tenant and landleech.
I do hope you don’t expect to view your next property before you move in…
Possibly in a vacant flat? Peoples rents are so astronomically high that a landlord should be able to afford some fallow rent time while looking for new tenants, and if they are not that financially solvent then maybe they should not be juggling mortages. It was this kind of borrowing that lead to the subprime mortgage economic collapse of 2008
Interesting. Poster reports she lives in Chelsea and is "sending child to an expensive prep"
https://www.reddit.com/r/cii/comments/1k18ctl/comment/mnz5w4i/
>former analyst and banker
I got as far as this and was like "ah, now it all makes sense". Then I made the mistake of reading the first paragraph and I just can't even!! Talk about rich people problems...
Legally, No you don't have to accommodate viewings, but in these situations it's usually good to compromise.
Maybe offer a few hours on the weekend for viewings. That way the landlord has viewings, and you have them all out the way in one go.
That's totally unreasonable IMHO. You are choosing to move out and you doing that is causing a financial burden on the owner by increasing a potential void period.
I get that it can be inconvenient so to allow access on maybe one or two occasions for block viewings would probably be enough.
void periods are outside the tenancy and not covered by the deposit. Also, tenant paid for the exclusive right of the property, that doesn't change in the last month. Downvote me if you like but it's the truth.
Never said they were I'm saying that it's bad etiquette to refuse viewings in the runup to leaving a tenancy. Doing so would extend the void period for the landlord and potentially encourage the LL to increase rental ask onto the next group of tenants. It may be legal but it's a scummy thing to do IMHO.
Previous replies say that without viewing being per!itted before move-out, then those void periods will end up being another unwanted cost that LLs have to figure in when setting rents.
We always have at least 2-3 weeks between flat turnovers anyways. There is always upkeep work beyond deep cleaning of carpets. Repaining if it's been 2 yrs, sometimes 1 yr, new, toilet seats are a must, blinds/curtain replacements if not cleanable, oven cleaning, snaking drains in kitchen, basins and showers/baths, replacing cracked wall tiles, razor scraping shower glsss of soap scum and limescale, taps caked with limescale. degreasing hobs, hoods/chimneys inside and out, extractor fans cleaning inside and out (tricky on ladder).
Just a sample of prepping for re-letting. This all takes time when you are doing it yourself, especially in an older building.
I would suggest to remain on good graces and good references state that you can allow a few viewings when you are there. Say that you don't give permission for viewing when you are not home, make it clear that no viewings are to take place when you are not home. Let the agent do two or three and then "Sorry, I'm now too busy until I leave due to preparing to leave, no more viewings until I'm gone".
More likely to be respected and get a reference instead of a landlord trying to take your deposit and give you a bad reference.
As a landlord, in 6 or so tenancies, I have never had a case where viewings were refused unreasonably. I have also never had a case where I did not allow the tenants leniency in terms of damage and cleanliness, during the tenancy and at its end.
If they had refused viewings unreasonably I would have found a way to make them suffer for it. There is always a way.
OP will see quite quickly how karma works, if they refuse viewings unreasonably.
Did you not go and view whilst someone else was there? Grow up.
I stand corrected. Apparently you can refuse outright. Apologies all. I just went on my own experience of renting for decades and always being able to view the properties so assumed common sense played a role as I've never heard of anyone willfully refusing to allow viewings if they are planned in advance and at a convenient and appropriate time.
Of course they can refuse outright, how the agents find new tenants is a them problem.
Quiet enjoyment is a statutory right. I don't particularly like it as a landlord, but it is what it is. It is better to fully understand the facts in advance.
That's it, my "quiet enjoyment" precedes whatever viewing clause in the contract.
Yes you can legally refuse out right
why the hell is that my problem? Who cares about those agents.
You can't refuse, it's not your house.
Landleech can do nothing tell him to go spit and you can even change locks and he can can still do fk all (just keep the old ones)
I've refused every single request to enter any flat I was letting for any reason (not that they would be able to with changed locks). It's always nice to put landleech into its place.
This is a community for Landlords. You can be anti-landlord in other places like /r/HousingUK/
Ask in the legal advice or tennant sub, you’re asking landlords if tenants have rights, of course they’re going to try to gaslight you.
You have the right to quiet enjoyment of your home, landlords can not force you to allow anyone into the property except for emergency repairs. Tell them no viewings.
Oh get off your soap box. Loads of landlords gave constructive advice. The OP is a landlord too as well as a tenant and actually should know these things