Updating post from Reddit.
Hi guys I m renting the house from my landlord and I m the only one on contract. I m subrenting 2 rooms for 2 people. Do I need to have hmo licence?
Your landlord is the one who needs to license. You are a tenant.
A house with three unrelated people is classed as a HMO
You are right OP is a tenant. But they (OP) are also landlord to their (OP's) lodgers.
(If a 3 person HMO is licensable in OP council area then) either OP or OP's LL needs to get a licence. It's not by default OP's LL's responsibility, seems like OP has created the HMO and their (OP's) LL may not even know about the lodgers.
Lodgers are not tenants.
Noone said they were.
I said OP is the tenant of OP's landlord (since OP's landlord does not reside in the property).
OP's 2 lodgers (if OP is their landlord which seems very likely) are not tenants.
I have edited my previous to be explicit - in case you misunderstood.
I have permission she doesn t mind. Yes, I m paying rent by myself to the landlord. The people are not on contract. But I started to think if I need hmo or my landlord.
You landlord needs the HMO. It can be a double edge sword though because she may (rightly so) think that maybe it was easier to let to one family unit than have to go through HMO licensing.
You are the Landlord in effect to your 2 renters. There doesn't need to be a written contract in place. You collected rent from them and that forms a legal contract. You therefore are liable to meet all national and local laws and standards for the property as well as your landlord. Potentially very strict fines and severe consequences for you both. Get professional advice asap
Agree, it would have been better for OP's landlord to not permit subletting and therefore no risk of falling foul of HMO licensing.
Yep you rent someone else property it doesn’t give you the right to do as you please . You are in breach of contract and abusing the system this is why there are less and less properties to rent . You are part of the problem giving people nowhere to live
Bit strong since you haven't seen OPs contract. & sounds like OP is giving 2 lodger place to live.
But yes: this is probably not permitted (contractually).
A very good point. This is where it becomes a bit like tenant inception.
Would the council consider it three tenants or is this one tenant with two lodgers.
The council will consider it an HMO because it is. Question is who are managing/controlling? In this circumstance there are 2
If the 2 subsequents have a legal relation only with the 'original' tenant (bonus points if the LL doesn't know about them) then they are lodgers (as the reside with their landlord)
Sorry if it’s a bit harsh , but it’s the truth the people which abuse the rental system are the people that are making people homeless as more and more landlords pull the plug because of issues caused by these sorts. There’s so much protection for tenants and less and less for landlords leaving them exasperated when the tenants choose to abuse .
Why is this abuse of anything?
Landlord's 'pulling the plug' sound like they are the ones making people homeless tbh
There's no abuse happening here I can see. The LL is still getting paid. If the tenant breaches their contract (and the LL feels strongly about it) they have recourse (s8).
OP also mentions in a comment reply that LL has given permission. What's the 'abuse'?
Assuming England.
You (a renter) + your 2 lodgers IS an HMO.
If you were an owner not a renter it would NOT be an HMO (exempt). But you are not.
key question as you asked is: 'is it a licensable HMO?' (IE does the HMO you have created need a licence?)
it being licensable For a 3 person HMO...it depends. You need to check the local council rules. It's not by default licensable (like a 5+ppl HMO is) but the local council can still run a 'Additional HMO' or 'Selective' scheme that may make your property licensable
check on council website searching <council name> + licensing
Good website if you are in London (you can select boroughs): https://www.londonpropertylicensing.co.uk/ (noting, usually in London such a property will be licensable...but do check the local rules)